Blue Cavern

hi all,

since some months i am in contact with Frank Oswald the publisher of the smurf-katalog and reporting him about new possible smurf-variations for the next cataolg that i discover from time to time - as i am buying often hobby-collections and like to search after new variations in those.
that is also the reason why i am posting some of my discoveries here to get confirmation if that are real variations.

since some days i have the idea that it could and would be a great thing if we could use the knowledge of all the collectors here to help creating a more complete smurf-catalog.
i just asked Frank what he thinks about that and he liked the idea! he thinks also that this could be a way to get the most complete catalog possible

what do you, especially the hardcore-collectors here think about that?

my thoughts are that we could go through *all* the smurfs and look through every variant that is already listed if we can confirm that variant or if there are mistakes/colourfakes/questionable smurfs and of course do we have some new variations that should have there place in the next catalog.
of course not every slight colour-variation.

the cottages are also a good example that the new catalog needs more informations about the houses and other playsets.

if we wanna do this than it might be useful to open an extra category (from an admin) for this as it would be a lot of informations to collect. but i think it will also be a very good resource for the future.

We have actually tried this idea before but there are just WAY too many variations if you include mold numbers, countries, color, etc. It became a huge task and while an excellent idea, almost impossible to execute. But that is the main reason we created the new section for Variations as well so that there would be a place to either look for or report a variant.

if we wanna do this than it might be useful to open an extra category (from an admin) for this as it would be a lot of informations to collect. but i think it will also be a very good resource for the future.

Yeah, that's why the section Variations of PVC smurfs was created

I don't think we can ever create a catalog as there are some things we all won't agree on, but we can discuss those variations or prototypes or paint errors in the section and agree to disagree in some cases.

With time this might become our online catalog

i understand the concerns because of all the possible variations.
but i still think it should be possible if there are some rules and if the main focus is "which variations should be in a printed catalog".
in the catalog i would like to find all the variations that a non-smurf-expert (a neutral person) also could determine(?) with help of the informations in the catalog.
i don't think to list all slight colour-variations, mold-numbers and colour-dots if there are no other differences between the smurfs.
the mold-number and colour-dots could be a good additional information for a unique variation. but if a different colour-dot is the only difference between two smurfs this would be nothing for the catalog. although those informations could be collected here if we want, but i would like to know what the majority thinks should be listed in the catalog.

i would like to give it a try and starting with "Papa Smurf - 2.0001".
i will start a topic in the "Variations"-section. of course it will only work out if we find a good way to document it.
maybe i will find out that it really is an impossible task

but if it seems possible we could go on with the newest smurfs and from there to the older ones as the newer ones will be more easy and faster to document.
i myself will collect those informations also in an excel-sheet.

Sure, go ahead....I think it will be very interesting to see what everybody comes up with

Do you want to include "only" the smurfs released by Schleich or also other licensend or unlicensed smurfs like Argentinia Minimodels, Brazil Herings, CNT and so on

There are also some very interesting older discoveries in the Variation section about the newer smurfs that you might find interesting and maybe we can incorporate those as well.

Starting with Papa is a big task...I agree that starting with the newer smurfs might be easier and not quite so overwhelming

I don't think to list all slight colour-variations, mold-numbers and colour-dots if there are no other differences between the smurfs.
the mold-number and colour-dots could be a good additional information for a unique variation. but if a different colour-dot is the only difference between two smurfs this would be nothing for the catalog. although those informations could be collected here if we want, but i would like to know what the majority thinks should be listed in the catalog.

I personally do not collect the different mold numbers and if the mold number is the only difference, I won't keep the smurf. I don't actively collect the different paint dots, however, I do keep those as variations, but I won't buy a smurf if the paint dot is the only difference and don't think these should officially be considered as variations. I also keep the different shades of colors, but I am aware that some of those were unintended or are due to age and don't think these should be considered as variations in a catalog.

hi maureen,

i agree with you

i am also not keeping smurfs with just different mold-number or color-dots or slightly different shades of colors in my collection. i am just writing down the informations about mold-numbers and color-dots in an excel-sheet.

i started now with the "Papa Smurf" - i think that one is a good test if it is possible to collect the most important informations.
but after that one i surely would go on with the newer ones.

and i would keep it like it is in the catalog: in the main-part should just be the Schleich- and Bully-Smurfs. for all other smurf-variations there should be an extra section.

Hi New-Swede

Welcome aboard. I'm from New Zealand and here we had a variation that hasn't been catalogued before (its in the variation section). I sent Frank what I know about this smurf some months back (the 1982 all-whites soccer smurf keyring variation).

Frank's catalogue usually includes a price guide but these have not been sold on ebay to my knowledge. We wouldn't know what they are actually worth. They are very hard to find but not widely known so not in demand. I generally see them on the local auction sites one every 3-6 months in good condition but because few collectors here they are sold in with bundles of miscellaneous smurfs or as a keyring or as just another soccer smurf.

A few have found there way to some of our blue cavern community collectors, so they feature on some of their websites. I can send better pictures if required.
cheers
Daryl

Keep me in mind the next time you see one Daryl

I would like to wish all of you Jokey Smurfs out there a HAPPY APRIL FOOL'S DAY!! I would love to see a catalog with the variations in it! But what a huge undertaking it would be!

hi daryl
i know that it is important for Frank to have some confirmations about new variations from other collectors. he could not put every unique variation in the catalog. there should at least exist some exemplares of a new variations that could be confirmed from other collectors.
that is why such a forum could be a great help

HI Guido,
the variation mentioned by Daryl seems to be a very valid variation as he found quite a few of those and traded them with many of us on here, so we have that variation.

It's the all white soccer player, which we believe stands for the NZ soccer player was only sold in New Zealand, which is why it was unknown to anybody of us.

We first heard of it about 2 or 3 years ago from another collector from NZ who wanted to trade it in thinking we all knew about it. Dyar actually made the trade with that collector and we hadn't heard anything else about that player until Daryl brought it back up last year.

Here is a picture that I got from Dyar's website. I have the player as well and can take a larger picture of it...just haven't had the time to do so yet


I think this variation should be included in the next catalog..as to how much it is worth, I have no idea...I have never seen it on ebay and they only seem to be available in NZ, however, quite a few of us now have it, so I am not sure if that makes it less rare