[mrs.einstein]

I agree with Martin.
Besides, it`s absolutely satisfying to have such a smurf in your collection, because the pleasure remains longer then the pleasure from an expensive holiday, camera or what ever...
And it`s a good investment too!

Margriet

[Syd Smurf]

I agree with you too Christy that this is a smurf forum to have fun and not start wars. I really do feel that if people want to have a whinge about things then they would be better off doing it privately to the person they have the issue with.

I do want to say a few things though just to clarify that when I said I am not interested in spending thousands of euros on one smurf, it was in no way putting anyone down that has. I have no problem if anyone does this, and would never consider them geeky or foolish for buying something they loved. There are plenty of nice people & close friends of mine who already spend a lot of money on smurfs, so why would I say they are stupid, geeky or try to poke fun at them? Surely it shouldn't make someone cry if I say I would rather buy something else with that amount of money.

Marto is right, my interest in smurfs is not as strong as it once was, but I am sure I have said the same thing many times in the past without anyone complaining, having a tantrum or calling me insensitive. If that was so offensive then surely Martin saying he wouldn't waste his time with CE markings could also be considered offensive to people who have bought one, or to someone you know that has bought one. Should that be considered a put down to anyone that has or wants to buy one? It's not offensive or a put down and never should be considered as such.....but then again, saying I wouldn't spend a lot of money on just a smurf is apparently something that I should feel bad for saying. I more feel bad for having to explain this as I really didn't think it would ever be necessary. I can not understand why anyone would think that way unless they are just super sensitive or have been waiting for something to critiscise me with for their own personal satisfaction.

I am sorry if people thought I said it in a way that they couldn't handle.....but the message is still the same & I think most people just took it as it was intended. I never said people couldn't or shouldn't spend a lot of money on a smurf....i just said that I wouldn't because there are so many other things I personally would prefer. It was relevant to the discussion and I still stand by that.

I want to reply to a few things just so people understand what is the reality of all of this:

A few collectors have these smurfs and have spent a lot of money on them (myself included). I do not have "more money than I know what to do with" (paraphrased), far from it. Does that mean I'm not cool?

What does cool have to do with anything? I never implied anything like that and I don't want people to think I did. What I said was a personal decision about my choices, it had nothing to do with what other people did or how cool they are. I have no idea why that was even brought up.

I understand your generic sentiments but there is no need to qualify them the way you did. Think about the people who do own these smurfs and put yourself in their position. Are they sad/geeky for doing what they did? When you infer certain things then expect criticism back.

Marto, I don't think you could possibly understand what I was thinking when I wrote the so-called offensive post, otherwise we just wouldn't be wasting our time with this nonsense. Again there is a mention of sad & geeky.....having to explain all of this is kind of geeky. I can cop criticism when it's warranted.....but I think Marto, you have made a mountain out of thin air with your complaint on this one.

in any case why are people being so critical of these prices? Shouldn't you be celebrating the fact that they are attracting expensive prices? Surely it reflects a burgeoning market which is great for everyone involved in the hobby. These prices are the kind of thing that gets noticed in the press and attracts more collectors etc...

I was never critical of the prices.....I just said I personally choose not to spend that much like so many other people have stated. If you think I was being critical then you have to show everyone where you got this idea from. It is certainly implied that it had something to do with what I said.....but I just don't see it. I think it's cool that a piece of PVC can go that high......I just wouldn't spend that much myself on something that wouldn't give me any satisfaction back. I was just speaking from a personal opinion and was never referring to anyone else. I think you need to explain why you thought I was.....as you once said Marto,....if you infer these things then you should expect some criticism.

I thought it was just the English who habitually knock people and are constantly negative, it's easy to be this way- being positive takes effort.

I wouldn't say that as I have a lot of English friends.....but then again I have to ask......why did you knock me? I personally couldn't care less if you do, but I just didn't want other people on here to think I was implying something that came out of your imagination.

I still think your a good lad but you should be more careful when you're posting ( I think). You could have said "I agree with you Dominique" and left it that.

Yeah you're right about that point...I am a good lad....at least I was the last time I looked. However, I don't need to be told how I should post by someone that never welcomes a new member, wishes people Happy Birthday or joins in the spirit of the community. I get the impression that making people feel welcome here is all just a waste of your time and not worthy of someone who acts like he knows better than everyone else.

And actually anyone else who's having a pop at people who choose to pay these prices- don't bring any of your own personal criticisms into it or expect to be criticised back

This is a forum that allows free speech. There is an element here that is brewing for nastiness and I don't think anyone appreciates it. Nobody wants to be told that they can not express their own opinions, and especially when it does not refer to anyone else but themselves. I really think you have no right trying to lay down a law like this to people who are not even sure what your commitment to this forum has been.

To Staci: I know you are very close to Andrew. I didn't read anyone else's criticisms last night but have done now. It doesn't matter who you are to me, I felt I had to defend some of these issues.

It just sounds like you were singling out what I have to say for criticsm, rather than bothering to pay attention to what anyone else here has to post. You really didn't need to defend anything. It just appears like you have a personal problem with me. I suggest we take this privately and let the others smurf on. I doubt that many others would of felt the need you did...infact I doubt anyone else besides the few with personal issues with me would of even noticed anything wrong with what I said at all.

Dyar

[Cassiebsg]

Wow, this looks like a flame war...

Martin, I don't really get where you coming from or going to... but Dyar has every right to express his feelings, IMHO. Why should he not say what he thinks?

I didn't saw he him call anyone sad/geeky, or any other word to anyone, but seems to me that you somewhat feel you are and then when someone says "I won't speed that kind of money on ...." you take it personally cause you do, and you expect everyone to do it also.

This is a free forum where everyone's entitled to his or hers opinion, as far as I'm concerned, and it's one of the reasons I stay and enjoy reading and participating here.
We're all different, we all have different lives, different takes on life, different priorities, the one thing that we have in common is our love for smurfs and collecting them.

To you 3000 euros on a smurf is an investment, you and those that can afford getting one, will enjoy it, no matter if there are ppl that think that's too much for a smurf. You have it, we don't. You can take pleasure that your collection is complete, others will just dream about it. One think I'm sure, if we all could afford 3000 euros for a smurf, than that same smurf would probably cost 10000! And we would just love to have one, and find it at the price we think it's fair and affordable to our wallets.
Nothing would make me happier, that do go to a flea market and find some smurfs I know I'll probably never own (because they're too expensive for me) and find them there for a few euros. I know chances to that happening are like 5% or less, but one can dream right? :p

Personally, I don't consider my collections as investments, I do them cause they're fun and I take pleasure in trying to complete them or add to them. Why it's not an investment? Cause I don't think I would ever sell them... but who knows, one never know if tomorrow one needs money to eat or pay the rent, and be forced to sell something they love in order to survive.

Sandra

[Syd Smurf]

I have never seen my collection as an investment either. Collecting smurfs has always been about fun, and not taking life too seriously. I tried to learn as much as I can about them......but there is still so much I, and everyone else still doesn't know about them which makes the learning a fun journey throughout collecting. Sure some of our smurfs may have some value to them, but most of us just collect them cos they're fun to find and fun to tick off the list.

There are definately some smurfs in my collection that have personal value to me that I will probably never sell. They could be ones that were given to me as a gift that reminds me of that person or a special time, or ones that relate to my other interests and hobbies.

I think one of my problems is that I would just like so many things, smurf & non-smurf related, so my smurf budget has gone down a lot lately because I have more smurfs than I know what to do with or ever thought I would have, and because I lack things in other areas that I either need or would also like to enjoy. I do feel like I have smurfed a good life which included travelling to several different countries, meeting tons of interesting people and breathing the smurfing lifestyle over several years on and off the forums. There were times when smurfs were the only thing I thought about, and I liked living inside that bubble and immersing myself in smurfville. It has been very fulfilling with only a few regrets, but I also often forgot that there is a world outside of smurfs that can be very interesting and stimulating too. Therefore I can't personally justify spending big amounts of money on 1 smurf for myself, because I would miss out on doing so many other things that I want to do. I feel like I smurfed to my full potential over the years considering the obstacles and disadvantages that I had, which included obviously lack of money while I was seriously sick and had to quit a good job, and also the distance and expense of collecting from Australia where many smurfs are not found like they are in several European areas. I really don't think I could of done a much better job of collecting smurfs under those circumstances, but now I have different challenges and different goals.

There are also certain things in the smurf world that are a real turn off for not only myself but also a few other long term collectors. I have seen many fakes that were made to profit by deceiving people which is something that I find really ugly and hard to put up with. Not only did these people pay a lot of money for them, but they risk a nasty backlash, loss of money in what they thought was a good investment or possibly even being sued if the price reaches high amounts and is sold to someone who knows how to spot a fake item. That does sound extreme I know, but I have seen some stuff paraded as genuine by the seller & the buyer that I knew was 100% fake. Maybe it's only a matter of time before someone does take legal proceedings against a seller for trying to dupe a buyer. Afterall, some smurfs are not cheap and nobody likes to waste money on something that isn't what they expected. I have nothing against people spending huge amounts of money on smurfs or just one smurf......but I do suggest that you know what you're buying by learning as much as you can about the rarer smurfs and being aware how to spot some obvious ways that they are faked. There have been many times that I have not said anything about this but I started to wonder whether it's better to upset some people and risk insulting a friend....or have them going on believeing that their fake smurf is genuine. It's a tough call either way....the popular way is to stick your head in the sand and not say a word......however is this really helping anyone or the hobby itself. I hate being the bad guy but telling someone their smurf is a fake can really get you into a nasty fight very quickly.

I should point out that I am not referring to the 3 rare Christmas smurfs here. I have seen these in my hand and do really like them and can admit to not being an expert on them. They are nice looking smurfs for those fortunate to own them.

I also don't want people to stop buying rare and expensive smurfs, I just wanted people to understand that there are fakes out there and the smart thing to do is to be aware. It's just common sense really if you plan to invest in anything worth a lot of money. Just because someone says they are authentic.....doesn't mean they really know the truth or that they have yoru best interests at heart. The amount of times I have been told things are authentic by a seller, when I know beyond a shadow of doubt that they are fake is quite numerous. On blue cavern we used to have many good discussions on smurfs where different opinions were raised. Whether people were right or wrong, it didn't matter as much as the fact that people were learning more about smurfs than they would of if people kept quiet. Just because someone owns a rare smurf, it does not automatically qualify them as a smurf expert......that's like saying just because you can buy an expensive guitar it must mean you are a great guitarist. It doesn't work that way and I laugh when I hear people say things like that.

Anyway I am probably boring everybody to death if they have managed to read down this far, so I should stop and go & eat some lunch.

Dyar

[FlamingO]

I read to the end Dyer and wasn't bored

As I appear to have been the first person to mention investment and it appears to have re-occured through this thread I just wanted to clarify a couple of things.

I was trying to put across that seeing a high price for a smurf and a seller's name who bought it, does not tell me anything about their personality, lifestyle or wealth or how they conduct their own personal affairs. I would never automatically asssume that this person has shed loads of money or try and come to any conclusion whatsoever about them except they seem to like smurfs

If I knew a friend who bought a car for £1K and he stuck a £3K smurf on the dashboard, and another bought an identical car for £4K (which was 5 years newer and lower mileage ) and apart from that they had similar job, social life, holidays etc. would I think the first friend was rolling init?

For myself I have never spent more that £18 on a smurf and my promos are all mcdonalds I bought a chef the other day cause his spoon looked a bit yellow in the photo and when it arrived it appears to be a CNT ( ) I was as happy as a smurfer in smurfland

Have a great weekend all (This post will self-combust in 3 hours)

[Smurfysmurf]

I agree 100 % with all Dyar said, and wanted to give my input on a few very good points before going to lunch

On blue cavern we used to have many good discussions on smurfs where different opinions were raised. Whether people were right or wrong, it didn't matter as much as the fact that people were learning more about smurfs than they would of if people kept quiet.

This is one of the things that attracted me so much to this forum and which makes this forum so much superior to other smurf forum in my opinion. We have many experts on different levels (if there is something like a smurf expert out there) and each one of them or even us, people of little smurf knowledge, bring so many different aspects to the discussions, it's just a joy in itself to have them. It allows for many discussions and we all learn by them. Everything I have learned about smurfs I have learned from fellow collectors on this forum that shared their knowledge and opinions openly and freely and were always open for another opinion. Sometimes minds were changed and sometimes we all agree to disagree and to move on but we all learned more about that particular smurf.

Just because someone owns a rare smurf, it does not automatically qualify them as a smurf expert......that's like saying just because you can buy an expensive guitar it must mean you are a great guitarist. It doesn't work that way and I laugh when I hear people say things like that.

Yes, me, too. This is another thing I love about this forum. I came onboard two years ago and one of the first things I did was to read up on old threads, and I can't say how much I learned by that. These old threads also showed me that the collectors, that I had to come to know as experts started out as novices to smurfdom themselves and learned about smurfs by asking questions, being open to a discussion, and investigating each smurf themselves, learning by it and openly sharing their new found knowledge. As a newbie (two years ago) this gave me great hope that one day I may know more, too and be able to help others to gain a few experiences.

I also don't want people to stop buying rare and expensive smurfs, I just wanted people to understand that there are fakes out there and the smart thing to do is to be aware. It's just common sense really if you plan to invest in anything worth a lot of money. Just because someone says they are authentic.....doesn't mean they really know the truth or that they have yoru best interests at heart. The amount of times I have been told things are authentic by a seller, when I know beyond a shadow of doubt that they are fake is quite numerous.

Yes, again, I agree 100%. I have learned the hard way not to trust sellers, even the best of them, but rather to ask friends, that I trust, about a smurf before I buy it. I am not saying that every seller is a crook, but at the end of the day, every seller wants to make money and may have not investigated as thoroughly as possible if the smurf in question is really genuine or not. I also don't have hard feelings in regards to most sellers, it's just that before I spend a certain amount of money, I need to make sure the smurf I buy is worth the money, and I trust friends, that are not selling the smurf more in this regard than sellers who want to sell me this smurf.

Anyway I am probably boring everybody to death if they have managed to read down this far, so I should stop and go & eat some lunch.
Dyar

Yes, again...100% agreed...Let's grab some lunch

[SmurfingH]

If I had a smurf that was fake, I would hope that you'd all tell me. I read up on old threads too when I first joined (& still do from time to time) and I've learned loads. I'm a fast learner and think I can spot a fake but everyone makes mistakes and I would want to be told. I can't wait for a fellow smurf collector to visit, partly so I can show off my collection, but also to get another's opinion on my smurfs.

I don't think of my collection as an investment but I will try and value each item at some point just so that others know how much is there. If I wasn't around anymore, I'd hate for people to throw or give the smurfs away unaware of their potential value.

Being new to collecting (this time around) I'm very much in a smurfy bubble and loving it. I have enough problems with every day life and smurfs are my escape.

I didn't read anything wrong in anything Dyar has said and I do think the reaction was over the top. Having said that I wouldn't spend that kind of money on a smurf doesn't mean that I judge anybody who does and I never thought that Dyar did either.